SGU Episode 402
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| SGU Episode 402 |
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| 30th March 2013 |
 |
| (brief caption for the episode icon) |
| Skeptical Rogues |
| S: Steven Novella |
B: Bob Novella |
R: Rebecca Watson |
J: Jay Novella |
E: Evan Bernstein |
| Guest |
KW: Karl Withakay |
| Quote of the Week |
There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn't true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true. |
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| Forum Discussion |
Introduction
You're listening to the Skeptics' Guide to the Universe, your escape to reality.
special just call me bish games hello what is your channel I live in the US 2012 skeptics guide you lose your pictures passing through ugh music try to do I get the end did you ready for the following yeah actually this is the fastest speed ever done again stroke slot in last year's guys definitely really not something to brag about no one like it like a week or two afterwards wanna think about it call tones little bit about your journey into skepticism my journey into skepticism into actual skepticism rather than just eat chicken query really kinda started with a friend of mines blog called up like to send it to blow the heat release get this is related at all he covers basically pop me a comic books and medicine topics and also for many years wrote a very well followed review of House MD the show and he had some links to some other web sites one of which was respectful insulin checking out other blood the link to I found respectful influence in started following or excite and then from there kinda spread out to science based medicine in neurological to get to plug in thing just kinda grew from there pick up or click to be just want a simulated into the whole eggs actly home network how's your implant going to talk about that Eric Bell is your journey is complete bike is around yes yes you say that remind me of a certain Emperor once you said yes exactly
This Day in Skepticism (2:39)
March 30: Happy birthday to Mary Whiton Calkins and happy death day to Ellen Swallow Richards. Two BAMF ladies for the price of one.
Alright well let's get started. Rebecca, you're going to tell us about March 30th yes happy birthday to Mary Whiton Calkins and happy to stay to Ellen Sullivan church that's right it's a twofer on my studies 1863 Mary c*** incest porn in Hartford Connecticut not that far from you guys she developed an interest in philosophy and psychology which of the time is the new discipline and is considered a part of philosophy to studying at Smith and then she went on speech at Wellesley learn more about psychology sedation she could teach it and so at Harvard nearby was the perfect place to go because there was a few schools with the psychology lab time unfortunately its not her because they didn't admit women professors there to sit in on their lectures despite the fact that the president of the college said that she would not be considered a tree stand it would be informal learning did it anyway and after year there she figured out and stuff so she could go back to Wells in San Fran psych lab but she returned Harvard to continue her education and once again to send a hard person who said nope you cannot be a real student you can only sit on IMAX is informally so she did as she conducted experiments 27 lectures she presented pieces with your professors unanimously agreed was more than sufficient for her to get her doctorate but Hartford continued to refuse to give it to her after many years Harvard agreed to allow Radcliffe College the right to give doctors to Calkins and a few other women who had informally study at Harvard but c*** in her shoes do to the unfairness of it all the symbolism she still had a pretty great life she went on to become the first president of the American Psychological Association she delivered several major contributions to psychology missing concerning the psychology of the self I heard discovery Chanel bit dated but she did time for the field she's also a noble fir open the question accepted scientific ideas about the differences between men and women putting out that her colleagues were adequately controlling for the environment when they made vol. town since about biological differences between men and women thank god that doesn't happen anymore I know right grown up since then so yeah she was in the early awesome woman in science and early Christmas Day is Ellen silo Richard she died on March 30th 1911 and she is the one who came with the idea of home economics as she believe that women who work in the home deserve to be educated and to be important you contributing members of society she had a ton of firsts for lice if you give me for a meeting directly from Wikipedia for mother she was the first woman admits hes my key and I see stars female instructor the first woman in America to be admitted to school science and technology and the first American woman to earn a degree in chemistry South Elmsall Richard and Mary Whiton Calkins too bad ass women in science Priceline Trail Blazers
News Items
Homeopathy Debate (6:11)
So did I tell you guys that I actually participated in a debate a Yukon last week no I know I get my invitation yeah it was about homeopathy I debated that was the strongest argument just remain silent call the whole argument here all week show me that was Andre sane who is Andy and natural path a member of the Canadian naturopathic society and also a pass on the eve of practice is homeopathy what a similar debate in 2007-08 icon yep if there is there dinner recipies tree on three but this time is 11 and you sayings there to 6 years ago free runs tonight Russian race is there absolutely very interesting there's anything new in the world of homeopathy but it is interesting to see what they're saying now to and how they handle specific argument essentially his approach is this he would prevent me from one of my many articles everything homeopathy saying that there is no critical evidence to support you whatever just some statement about homeopathy how many grams of no active ingredient whatever and any presents some study that contradicted my statement in a really good city to the point oh yeah haaa it was the most pathetic the crappy study you can imagine that he found in tirely compelling as it is established The Sims this is now this is done this is a stablished this is down we can take this is a fact that the cross to the differences in state between to decide to send normal real people that was such a difference between me and him in terms of how we defend our positions I think that um they're probably other differences in terms of river coming from for example can go over everything is it was a little long to bake but when new singer homeopata saying these days it was a paper published in India in the last year where the researchers found that even is so cold Ultra Molecular Dr Lucien's that means graders and avocados number so they shouldn't be any active ingredient left that's what they do to get the papers published you know homeopathy no respectable journey Journal looked on sleep now because I'm used to Lucia that stats increase penis your page using this now low energy nuclear reactions write something to get away from the stink of cold fusion its the same conclusion nude the new homie out the terminologies ultra molecular yes to the delusion that sounds kinda comic book to Lucy it should be delusions and she's come delusions that's awesome did they really did a true electric does dilution today still found nano particles of the starting movies radiant nano particles in a molecule what are they use this thing to study the small uncontrolled and of course design controlled blanket is nothing a blind is no control and constraint it is a study buddy is explain what that means when you say on controlled group the researchers knew what they were looking for and lo and behold they found it yeah they didn't compare it anything dude no worries dear this is a contaminant what it actually is where I come from what it means its just a found an anomaly and that was it that's Italian know in which type as the water running Hey the sticks point and the reason why that sucks is it is totally skew the results it invalidates I think I remember reading about that they didn't even do a test of their water before to compare to the afternoon in German if it already has a contaminant it to be in town crazy Sin City on a sober here early one of the office this paper wrote an email to Harry Hall in science based medicine and say hey look at our paper we know you guys are skeptical of proving that is actually stuff in there I would be happy to engage with you in a dialogue about this new exciting scientific evidence and Harry Reid back to replace she is and said text that's nice can you at your service my opening you guys can you tell me why the window controls samples in your study the author wrote back and said we don't discuss things with nasty skeptics this is the end of the conversation oh hey I picked a date there we go how to date today actually use the word nasty II might have said so bet that was there oh yeah oh yeah right you emailed us and now you don't want to have a discussion Cosby ask you one question why did you not include a control group that was the end of discussion that's the club that is the study that Andre quoted as Steve contradicting my claim that old for molecular dilutions don't have any active ingredients to do is gone with say to all this PC using st little skeptical hahahahahahahaha nice Brian did you tell that story on stage yes I did get this is hilarious course I did yesterday knows it that's like that was the exchange you know he is one crappy study after another and then I went to the clinical evidence and I presented and the systematic reviews now I deliberately chose a systematic review that was not altered by a charger its cause I know they hate him for dinner also included his systematic review of systematic reviews for 2010 could still the most current thorough systematic review a chemical studies of Cochran review systematic reviews of homeopathy and it completely naked is a meeting change it includes in at home remedies do not have any sex p on placebo and his response to that was Jordan's not a real homeopath he only took six months or whatever not two years of training and you lied about being on the name is a nasty person you just listen to an ad hominem attack against turn ons and against me for relying upon and charger for my analysis which is not true reliance credit in months and studies myself in any way hey sorry was conducting a systematic review of Cochran reviews cheap collating with decent he wasn't doing research for you what you need to do directly you just summarizing the results of the systematic reviews at work that you're high quality
Shooting the messenger instamessage that's ridiculous trash in one thing we didn't it was fun about this today is always be ready to ask each other questions so I asked him what is the indication sure which homeopathic remedies have been shown to be effective in multiple high quality reproducible clinical trials and yeah he did should try to dodge a little bitty ceesail your day just like the did Jacob review of the Grammys for diarrhea that was his best case that's the one that he said he threw out there so I can see anything at me like I do remember the Thea details of the homeopathic remedies for diarrhea I just didn't like review the right before the debate so I could use I could have turned off but I did afterwards for my blog view updated and even the time is it is a bit ok good talking about surfing small methodologic the flood studies studies with mixed results Jacob three studies for diarrhea and Caesar in this is a homeopath this is guy trying to spin in a positive direction and he said that she you indicated is possibly in a sec you're a note to your other authors review the same three studies instead d Steve's results for mixed sweetheart three studies with mixed results that's your not compelling evidence and Jacobson the following web study that was your break a wrist and was dead negative show once again we have this pattern of the better studies are negative you never get any consistent signal is consistent a second from the clinical research it's just these mixed results to know when you finally get around to doing a rigorous studies negative studies done by homeopaths 7c had to offer clinically Cheetos same thing is that she has studied the historical evidence for homeopathy so he goes on and on about display getting in the 1800 silver homeopath treated Colleran cured everybody you know take really that is a hundred year old anecdote soup is supposed is compelling evidence is the clean today May the effectiveness of homeopathy during those plagues were true it would be absolutely trivial to demonstrate homeopathic remedies for affective against does epidemic illness is Right see it and if its not as effective as they say in the morning in the end results are not reliable which is the ID be easier exclamation 850 you ain't to pre scientific reports indicate a report of homeopathy works a lot of Physics Chemistry and and physiology on the other side what's more likely to be wrong give it to their best options for talking about times when homeopathic hospitals people weren't dying is often because the doctors were deleting people to death mean you're having terrible sanitary conditions at an exit to it they were doing any kind of active treatment it's just that they weren't killing in place quickly panel doctors reason careful techniques 200 years ago doing nothing was an advantage him so that's the update on defending homie I see so did you have a good time enjoy doing that was fun and what was the audience response what is packed homeopaths app haha its so excited
Small Pterosaur (17:10)
So Evan, you're going to tell us about a tiny fossil hunter in a tiny fossil. But first I'm going to ask you all this so what were you doing when you were nine years old what is a long time scar what were you doing when you were nine years old can you remember wow that would have been 81 probably be thinking about Star Wars The Empire Strikes Back Sunday right myself I was some kind of 5 grams is constantly daydreaming prepubescent stating that I had a healthy fascination with fire to put it lightly seasoned Niners soldier your boyfriend you know these things fascinate you that it but I'd like you to meet Daisy Morris she's nine years old he hails from the Isle of Wight in United Kingdom show and she just had her first restrict creature named after her JC's mother says that her daughter has been a fossil hunter since the age of story and by the time she was 5 years old p**** 2008 Street in her to earth 3rd year of her paleontology I'll be walking on the beach looking for fossils and sure enough she hit up a Leo jackpot dark colored bones for protruding from the sand in her pass she stumbled across the remains of a cleaning her I could only be generated by that of a five year old girl she took a deep breath and she said aloud dang there is no is going on okay so she carefully click to the phones in together with her mother they brought the bones to Southampton University uh they're the professors study instead their tests and they were able to determine that these bottles for a new genus and species of small Paris or the crap that in Xmen book your findings find fossils is exciting enough to discover any kind of fossilized is a rare spirits for anybody to have found the fossil remains of a new genus and species that I say is practically beyond belief yeah and I would get to heaven and after you look absolutely I was a total loser when I was nine pterosaurs in case you don't know we're worth flying reptile struge from the Lower Cretaceous. Which some training 65 million to 220 million years ago and they're saying that the speaker find sesame to be around a hundred twenty five million years old and the reason that it was in the news just recently is fat this new species name is officially confirmed in the scientific paper published I just a few days ago so yes you would like to officially welcome Drako DC Morris I to the collected some of human scientific understanding awesome so cool can a researcher cruiks date their wings the other mainly supported by the other PT address is usually extended is this very different birds or bat Soopers Bachan enters Rizzoli vault flight goes completely completely different Anatomy bats have I called her fingers support their wings and rings are basically the fingers Birds their wings there arms and terrace or is it just a dinner one thing usually longest finger knuckle a good idea sounds painful to what are these what does this creature actually look like they have a drawing of it or anything out yet yep they have they do have some drawings of it had a wing span of about two and a half feet and was just over a foot from snout to tail show picture the size of a goal or large pro off today so pretty small sexy when you I compare to its size larger cousin Castle which had a wingspan a more than 30 feet what is very small but its close cousin was the largest thing to ever fly on earth that we know of its cool for lots of different reasons obviously the age of person involved Daisy fantastic it's cool she's hunting bones at that age you know like I said were most certainly don't even remember what we were doing back and I think it dries on the point that there's a little luck involved in the process right I mean timing is it is essential here this the bones on the beach me to veggli would have found your way into the ocean and swept away a roadway and set adrift or whatever question about the situation is that time ok normally if you find a fossil imbedded in rock somewhere in urine amatuer he was just wondering not use your not a scientist can you come across puzzles you're probably better off leaving the bones where they are and is this going to want to investigate we're the bones are in bed at night just the bones of cells that other day made date them based upon the rock Aaron but the situation is a little different she found them on the beach right cities are probably already washed away from wherever they were deposited right now and probably to the sand on the beach that doesn't really matter right there's nothing to be gained by finding those bones in that doesn't tell you much about it about when are the surrounding area you know when something is fossilize Argos that process and the tissue decays around the bones and everything it mean is there anything in the immediate ground rate was the best touching the bones that gives any DNA or any kind of samples for scientist to find out more about the tissue the creatures at all just completely obliterated when bench fossilized by definition minerals around the bone replace house human bones on and did a little early to come stone uh a retainer structure but f****** lies bone can still retain some DNA me can extract tiny amount of DNA even from afar slides cost wise bones ok to tens of thousands of years old not wear the actual real case you used to live outside of the bone like to meet of the Laker whatever there is nothing in the dirt right there were that use to be right no no no I'm not at no cost wise is any soft tissue is completely destroyed probably never fully dressed parking and I get DNA into it and grow into a dinosaur because it to dine DNA just does not last that long does an upper limit Wade where did you know what we're doing a Will Survive I have no time limit is nasty to know what it is about that reason it's certainly not 65 million years yeah you just think bacterial gobble it all up and food Damian has to be very special conditions low oxygen conditions for example of things it's falling to the silk at the bottom of the river yeah thats thats were things get finalized most of the stuff is dies on the surface somewhere he does get completely decomposed and does not only very tiny percentage of bones end up getting f***** like the wind up in some special um environment send me some when we don't you talk about the same reason why we don't see bones laying around everywhere outside because it's taken away by rodents and Aliens in things yeah efficiently destroyed yeah.
Fracking Earthquakes (25:05)
3d fish in the destroyed get a little fun J you're going to tell us how fracking is causing earthquakes to the question here is to frack or not to frack or should have said to Frank or not to frack that is the question right ah yes I thought you'd appreciate that I've been absolutely d a basic idea fracking just quickly remind the audience is ot fracking is when you inject water sander chemicals into the deep shell formations in you trying to break them apart underground and what what you're doing is trying to release gas is Royal River is it your you're trying to pull out of the ground you're trying to Lisa from breaking up all of that shell that's under there so take a peek a boo big pressurized well in essence exactly what fracking it's the problem is that fracking uses a way to build a water to do what it does so on Tuesday the 26th of March researchers from University of Oklahoma Columbia University in the US Geological Survey publisher latest findings about hydraulic fracturing oil and gas also known as fracking a publisher findings in the journal geology and what they found was a reference a earthquake that happened on November 6 2011 it was a 5.7 magnitude earthquake that happened in Oklahoma and they say it was like to drilling and Indian junction of water that as I explained part of the fracking in drilling process that earthquake was followed by eight and 11 fold increase in seismic activity across the center US in recent years the earthquake was the biggest States history and could be the largest link to the injection of water from the drawing process but all the experts don't agree States Geological office said it was like who's likely the result of natural causes find interesting me know if you're still not 100 percent sure what's causing it you know we have different parties coming up with different conclusions it seems to me though that there's a lot of people saying that fracking definitely can cause earthquakes that was really strange you think about it like you take a quick is kinda like a tornado took a really big thing that can I can humans have any real effect on that but from what I read the idea is that the injection of all that work and as you can think of it is essentially a water is doing is all that liquid that in that region of the ground is is loosening up its giving if its making things able to slip in slide in that can cause an earthquake in I guess it is a little bit it's not as stable as I thought it was already what is soon that was the research paper wars sets sposal of the millions of gallons of fluids from the hydraulic fracturing is most likely cause in a proposed that the government needs to have better monitoring and oversight involved with the doll fracking procedures now I thought this is interesting so it was 1970 to the year 2000 decide activity in the US is Mary Jane average about 21 inches in 2 year that number went up to 58 in 09 it went up to 87 in 2010 and 134 2011 show you okay it seems like that's a smoking gun I don't really know what those results mean because he knows you're just to be some type of thing going on we don't understand but they're using invormation like that answers your end because of concerns over earthquakes caused by fracking do UK stop the practice is fracking temporarily until the late until late 2012 and then at that time they said we're going to be allowed again standard place so oily gas industry in the United States for now the other ways to deal with these waste waters for the same reasons that's where we're at with fracking.
Search for another reason study J that showed that to increase to earthquakes only happen when the water injection is your fault line which makes sense that other areas to the fracking to tell without is the water getting access to a fault line doesn't cause earthquakes that makes sense yet I didn't find anything that address this question maybe you just don't know the answer yet it seems like it if you did Mira fault line is making it easier for you know that these are the rock to slide against each other to different side to side against each other so are these essentially trickery a lot of little cakes that would have never really happened anyway you're leaving I don't know it I think it's getting late 20s no fault which would have been one big earthquake if you had let it take its course I don't know its a hard question I couldn't even begin to answer it at my only comment is is it better to have these small earthquakes in one big one of those easier to deal with her maybe you does the aggregate amount of damage from 20 small Craigslist as one big one is there a big difference I have no idea it is very interesting topics oh and I think I'm glad the people doing research into it I don't know there be any way for them to tell me what the time table would be in that circumstance is Steve say you know it even if the answer lyrics yes that this is many small earthquakes instead of one large one that will eventually happen I don't know that they could tell you when I would happen in a2 yes for now in a million years from now you're just doing a testicle information about how many cakes 1920 happening in just trying to do correlate that with fracking activity um but its hard to get together you could do a controlled study right you can't replace a vent and see what would happen to have enough track keep looking at this city in 30 years showing the Esther Marie CraigsPal only if 250 injected waters getting access to a fault line and now they have to do a lot more tickling ounces to see what the f facts are men need to compare areas that aren't being fractora longer. Of time just keep getting more data you know if they're not actually treated at yo send super volcano yeah I will be pissed on still play level of destroying the Earth like that epicly scary stuff United States create a winter of sorts Edo bring to so much junk into the atmosphere affect the world wife but its not to park in garage to know what the salts worse much worse what's that oh my god that would say that that description imagine looking at of I never option from horizon to horizon like a mile in the air stealing love it and it lasts about you know a few thousand years and then it stops and then starts again for like another thought its like really really happened on yeah yeah look at the DMV to call the DI and furious last week I called about this Capricon in a kilometer do you know if this all to meet at the Superbowl can we look like you know not not that much is how long will it take for me to die if I see that mile high magma wall on my god seconds minutes what states its nasty nasty and Chris crack in what is much as I like a good fracking story ah I read a couple more articles on this and even followed the abstract on the thing and it looks to me like they're not actually talking about fracking in this case but they're talking about a waste water from injection wells which is a little bit different than hydraulic fracking and that it just did you clear wake with created by injecting wastewater into pleated wells waste water used in a slightly more conventional form of oil extraction but nonetheless would have major implications but nonetheless would have major implications for fracking because fracking produces a large amount of wastewater that need to be disposed Carl's Jr was a little unclear they are predominantly talking about what they're going to do with the tracking wastewater because you're so much of it and they are currently pumping all that water into the ground yet another interesting thing they said most of the water that they use a Steven make it into the ground but it's still a phenomenal amount of water that's left in the earth.
Never Eat Again (33:48)
Will make time you're going to tell us about the man who never has to eat again cool it will rob Ryan Hart has a a blog or website remember him from on the fam awake now lisa has a nice name of mostly harmless something somebody post about on Facebook I found the link and he barely decided that he was really just tired and resentful of all the money in time he invested in heading to prepare and consume food and then having to clean up after himself in so he decided he was going to reduce is diet to just all the essential nutrients and was going to create himself a simple beverage containing all the essential elements in nutrients he needs and he would call it a lynching show me name my name is awesome hey put some green food I am married but good well soon limitless to fu K and sayings Greenlees people yes cell contents in it does insanity indicate the mint green fried rice search an image is associated yet technically it wasn't but word I mean it you know its in the sci-fi saying its fun but II think it was its not a bad name for it you wouldn't name your kids or land sale anyway just say it really fascinated me about it was fairly unscientific way you went about doing it here he basically here in a few books search internet for nutrients in just kinda started hodgepodge putting in what he thought were central nutrients in trying it out on him so women taking it with adding things mean he started feeling sick or something and realize that he did not did iron in he retired in after the factors I guess simple research on essential nutrients didn't mention iron he didn't you didn't do what I would do in a situation like that where to buy find nutritionist in a bit of my medical doctor friends and discuss with them what they thought I need to do just kinda went out on his own a big is a break futures supplement industry are you doing secret of going to the supermarket and bought a six pack of ensure oh well you're really really funny but really invented in his kitchen something that already exists on the market multiple brands you know how much read all the sciences already completely balanced all the nutrients and put it all together for you and it actually tasted 2:30 sure meant to be a complete diet replacement? yes Exactly what it is meant to be a complete guide replacement wow your food story of the number of that specific one there for people who can't eat and to need to live on milkshakes basically IIIC releasing Steven mean I don't German entrepreneurial perspective like go ahead I think it's fine if he did he's trying to do this and not as long as he finally does get FDA approval tree ever wanted to take it that way but I think Jesus cooking something is on kitchen for now in an hour or so how did did you say the article that he was going to try to sell them since she posted his original blog is head many people contact information and apparently he's got numerous people now I'm also trying this out at the same time interesting mentality when you think about where the guys coming from heat he doesn't want to waste the time and in the expense of you just want to get over this soon as you can for the most part I don't think he was eating this 100 percent it was the having a few normal meals here he was something like will for 30 days he said he ate only this and then he kind of started going back to eating mostly this but you know when you get together with friends you'd still dine in the preciate dining but he still I think more than 75 percent drinking is oil yeah you seem to services to read uh a couple years ago on the issue for ins where some people were talking about a surprising number of them all she did eating like the sound of painful anything but they were what a Magin a must be like to be a****** are you know they just think they found absolutely no pleasure in eating so the had your touch me to the trying to find a solution to because it was just a wasted expense because they do they weren't getting anything out of it so they wanted something that was basically like I see it take it make you know days in advance East keep in the fridge in drink as needed to save the time in the money that's what I thought of a name for Swiss reading about this guy doesn't sound like he's actually like that it sounds like he's just like a nerd who won wanted to do this for the hell of it NFC says see you like sleepin it is really make sense to me in and out in that regard but it does make sense to me for the people who to take out solutely no joy and eating people who yeah I know it's hard to make peanut butter I know but I that's just the way there to take as much time you get home from work and you just want to eat like a bowl cereal for dinner you don't want to have to go through the hours that cooking and eating cereal for the New Year me alone and spend weeks making yourself sick over something you haven't researched properly. He said Something interesting where he was tweaking it like a chemistry experiments and he would plus or minus the calorie intake to to regulate his body weight and he was your day he kinda called at hacking music hacking his body in a way that wasn't a terminology used in the article is wrong I find it interesting you know I think its more its Cole truly interesting to me to find people that are finding eating inconvenient and everything and I couldn't disagree more the I would like I said yeah I'll throw down a bowl of cereal here there but for the most part I want to sit down have a warm meal and ovary and enjoy myself I love it we too much meat balls all the way all the articles about this no one mention of product already exist I just found out I have a party pooper Stevie Wright tracks from this not only do they not mention it to kiss but a lot of the Articles go on about how this is this solution to the yeah yeah hungry people really not the solution with something not too long ago like I was at my desk and I'm like I'm thirsty but I don't want to have to put my lips on the faucet like I need something vented like this for liquid know that my desk my hand I'm going to run with it open your mouth open and you just left it out it's really cool that works I think you just saw the world huh that's right I think you start a campaign of fun that I'm already I'm doing it right now and you drink beer and right now to Fahrenheit well done yes working on it show her.
Voyager at the Edge (41:52)
Show her right Bob your team is a quick update on the Voyager probe yep way too was yet again in the news on this past week or so of paper published in the American Geophysical Union sweats I claimed dad 421 appears to have trouble be on the influence of the Sun and exited the huge beer but it turns out that to celebration which was perhaps a premature a national quickly reported the announcement saying that its a consensus of the warrior science Team Edward 21 has not yet left a solar system or reached interstellar space so whatcha what happened here who's right who's wrong with of person to know what would he lose your is it so it can be considered a boundary of the solar system is kind of a bubble surrounding our solar system will be on Pluto that contains essentially the Sun solar wind and its magnetic field is too to two main things kind of this plaza puzzle bubble as signals from 40 to Renee the fall of 2012 indicated two things that seem consistent with the idea of it being outside the heliosphere number one without a number less cosmic rays drops to a hundred of their former levels and I wish I was to wear these but apparently these are these your comment cuz you're crazy or trapped in the outskirts of the heliosphere and kick it out so I did they dropped to up what percent of winter formal it was work and the number to galactic cosmic rays greatly increased to put those together kinda makes sense you know things that are within the soul sister mmm kinda went away and things that are kinda outside increase ODOT reasonable to assume that a its going its left a solar system but nah she apparently has a number 3 on its list and according to them this linchpin indicator of the ID out your the end of the solar system is a reversal of the directions to make a text field in the solar system disk read about the Sun and this refers was not been detected next the bottom line for them if that did it hasn't been for first then were not outside yet today where is where you're right it's not outside at national bleach in it at this new features of the solar system call the magnetic highway this is kinda where the magnetic magnetic field of the Sun connects2 out outside and I surprise you that we find a new layer I to the solar system once we actually Center instrumentation out there so that's that doesn't surprise and very interesting and that's pretty much all I've got another one thing I wanted to cover Steve I think you made into creatures mistake I did last week or so and said that the two player on the board you know that did Golden Disk up with the church again edit images there is no playback mechanism on Voyager about that they said that there are instructions for how to play the record and voice your I assumed that meant the restrictions for how to use the player on the Prophet SAW II see the structure how to build a player not even that not even at it really to Heather how to play it theres is it image in the upper left of the off the record cell phone that seems pretty clear what it is and also apparently does a stylus does a stylus sexy there that they can use it shows how to edit use a stylus how to or into the way you can play it back and it also says things like what the rotation speed is to be one rotation for 3.6 second set of course she didn't express it the second was some it was simply a fundamental unit of time 25 I thought they had an actual fun band in Voyager Nike s style uh instruction booklet and scratching their heads in Wonder Years when I plan on it but I forgot those sexy well before iPod we don't have to worry about it Steve we know from Star Trek 5 to cling on to stress wagered target practice Oh I knew somebody was your day hahahaha you're 24 hrs the other ones easier became sentient don't forget hahahaha
Who's That Noisy? (46:01)
- SGU Forums: Who's That Noisy? Episode #402
- Why Worry? Answer to last week: Amanda Peet
It's that time again for you to tell us about who's that noisy yes indeed Stephen I'm going to play for everyone last week's who said no easy here we go porn when I talk to you tomorrow about 15 min early side that carries new wife no guesses lleno de ninos the lot of guests came in it was Jenny McCarthy play the clip that you have their pizza it's not obvious if this person thinks it there is an association between fact that there isn't right keywords it in such a way that it's a bit ambiguous of the rest of what she said she was definitely defending the practice of a vaccination and taking this way the anti vaxer so that is none other than our friend Amanda Peet's who's awesome you're awesome in 2008 people into the Xbox womens for every child by two to say non profit organization that advocates childhood vaccinations and she's been praised for her outspoken stance in those efforts cool aol.com and there were a handful of people actually got that corrected and from a random drawing this week's winners none other than Fred Rahmer a friend random thought they were over there were four correct guess I feel like a hundred or something bad kinda hoped but the notes for correct yes is in red you guys this week well done my friend Jason aldeans doesn't know Fred Bremer is the guy that is made it to every single issue dinner that we had a raven 20 after this week okay this week we have a logic puzzles for everybody three scientists Albert Isaac and Marie are talking to each other about a collection of scientific books owned by Jonas Albert says Jonas has at least four books by Maxwell Isaac says no Jonas has less than four books by Maxwell Marie says well according to me Jonas has at least one book by Maxwell if you know that only one of the three scientists is correct and how many books by Maxwell does Jonas possess my notes on Isaac the condition of you rinse it lasts a few Redbox your books nope I want to sing room how to make you c** when fewer vs less alright so WTN at the skeptics guide that word is the email address and SQ forms.com is our forums go ahead and post their send us an email however you like good luck everyone.
Questions and Emails (49:12)
Question 1: More than Gravity ()
I'm a friend of Rebecca's, a former CFI employee, and a huge fan of SGU, so let me start by thanking you for all that you do! My editor at Buffalo Spree magazine sent me a press release about two local scientists affiliated with Ecology and Environment, Inc. just outside of Buffalo, New York. They have apparently established something called the "More than Gravity" theory. I did some Googling and had trouble finding anything about this that didn't seem to come right from the press release; if two local scientists are using a prominent Buffalo company to promote woo, I want to know about it and write about it; that said, if there's something to this I am obviously interested in covering that as well. Have you heard anything about this? Having no physics background I don't have a lot of frame of reference, but the lead to the press release prickled my skeptic senses: "Through 50 years of research and observation, scientific and engineering experts, Gerhard and Kevin Neumaier, have developed a new theory that refutes the 400-year old assumptions currently held by the scientific community." Any help you could give me would be much appreciated! Thanks, Julia Burke
email Blake good luck everyone else to do one email this week this one comes from Juliet Burke have Rebecca's United Julie Burke awesome guest host restriction Julie Wright a friend of Bacchus a former see if I employ in a huge fan of SU so let me start by thanking you for all that you do iOS financial people thank me for all that I do really everything for right sitting at my garage activities to pick that hanging thing in the world to me mean my skin on my schedule things that I did not finish for you killed by the way don't get me started on my part cut the cornerstone live Thank You she writes Miami River flows free magazine send a press release about to lock a scientist affiliated with ecology and environment aight just outside of Buffalo New York and Paris tablet something called the more than gravity theory I did some googling and had trouble finding anything about this that didn't seem to come right from the car the press release if to local sin sister using a prominent public company to promote boo I want to know about it right if I did that said if there's something to this I'm obviously interested in covering that as well have you heard anything about this having a physics background I don't have a lot of favors reference but the lead to the press release pickled by skeptic senses and then here's a quote for the press release through 50 years of research in elevation certificate engineering expert Gerhard in Kevin Neumeier have developed a new series every few to 400,000 the simpsions currently held by the scientific community any help you can give me would be much appreciated so it I know you guys had to take a look at the more than gravity bedside my oh my this is like this is Neal Adams territory this is its not quite wanted jumping but it's getting close is there Siri P if you read their executive summary is daddy rose Retirement the planets are positions are quantized order found a simple equation actually predict a velocity of planetary orbits and distances from the Sun so do you say that what governs the movement of planets around the Sun and Moon and planets is not just gravity there's something else going on and what is their main pillars of evidence is the fact that the your pits of the planets around the Sun appear to exist in some kind of mathematical sequence you guys heard of that place before right yeah olds law facelock right which is interesting in talking to strangers before as well the is there anything to base line is it just a coincidence and eat your dizzy TV reading about it some more and good thing is now that we're finding lots of EXO planet will be contested boobs live you look at other solar systems then you David POS what is a law and not just a mathematical enumerate numerological Clinton city should hold up cash really gather enough data yet we don't really have complete solar system si no pin up to know but what send a strong reducing now is that well it's essentially pattern recognition if you have any solar system one thing you can say is that planets you're not going to be right next to each other because it would be stable they would bump into each other eventually so by necessity planet Earth to space them out to some degree once you settle into the remaining planet unstable orbits they have to be someone's face down and did you have any system like that you're going to be able to find some factors that send ratio that will match the Orbitz so its not that there isn't a pattern is that there's a going to be a pattern just a random chance alone to the fact that there is some kind of boat like pattern to any solar system doesn't mean anything. essentially I think with the destroyers saying now now leave you even have some additional data from EXO planet the disc I say nope this is a long distance is quantized like electric electrons are quantized in Adam Anderson relationship numerological stuff to try to show that it's something meaningful so you guys know what the extra thing is that is governing the movement of planets and moons wind is solar wind blow everything away yeah don't say so they fix the solar wind energy work space bunny where to now to take the cannon and heat treat wish sit in on the Kindle comes out the cannibal continues to travel in and she look like yes or classic so that's what they think is gonna eat your food at the seniors and doesn't travel straight arrow in rays from the Sun that it travels how in like an expanding spiral from the Sun Savannah cheese and veggies spirals what are pushing the planets in their orbits around the Sun oMFG well they have to overcome a lot of science saying the contrary if any wants to take them seriously come on Newton I'm Stein Kepler other guys are morons Mira my first question is why why why would you even speculate on this and I mean its not like I don't want to jinx JB cuz they thought they saw something profound and and then they ran with it rather than find it you ask in the question is this really real or is this just a pattern which seems to be real he didn't honestly ask that question and then before they finish going down that rabbit hole Dave completely reinvented physics and astronomy and everything and you know I saw on believable its been on since these guys are you in 4th but with mathematical equations and precision and everything so it is just so many interesting P here's a count the fundamental problems with their with their series you know you didn't save and doesn't travel that way even after solar wind follow the path they said it would still be pushing the plan it out its not allowed to reinforce it still would be a net force we from the Sun thinking it's more like water going down the drain uh vs going away I am I not towards the Sun they also used to explain why the moon's most of the big moon in the solar system are in a lock to orbit uh like the army now we should the same face to the Sun to the earth state of the solar wind is with pushing things down to the planet oh yeah I don't know when you're out when its night time oh you know when you're ready office into the planet pushing you down to grant the fundamental problems with this is their writers of course at work this solar wind and gravity doesn't explain precisely and completely explain the movement of the plan to the moon then the series by which we have been sending troops out to other planets would not work HM we did not we would not have been getting pretty pictures back of Jupiter and Saturn does probes landed precisely where we wanted to be recruited not have been profoundly of these guys claim. Justin just Impossible II read through all 43 pages are you a mess and I mean there's just way too much to even get all the highlights just a couple points I know if its older women that keep this on the planet didn't even explain how galaxies are bound together gravitationally babe there's no star in the center their basic cares like at one point they start talking about Dark matter energy quitting dark matter with black hole body piercing took from that was that dirt better it is easy is really a manifestation detector theories of gravity don't work headed to grab it doesn't work that's why we have to invent dark matter so thats it thats the least crazy of the things you say because it is pious some astronomers have been thinking of maybe modified to Tony in gravity is really the solution to dark matter how it turns out that ends in the ensuing years we discovered actual dark matter what it is but we could see that it's there it's not just that my new Tony gravity has to be modified but at least they have an argument Arizona Recreation's about gravity might be a seat and that's the real explanation for the missing gravity's states its not as dark matter sorry crazy for us well I got to do that but when ur talking about dark matter they were talking about scientist were searching for dark matter into quitting that to searching for black hole yeah I have that is if they thought they just suck dark matter with black hole yeah very hard to follow their arguments to hear it and I always felt like I was left hanging did you have this feeling kinda like you're in your building you up to this day exclamation exclamation never comes yeah it's like and here's your explanation it this way will know that's a statement you haven't actually given any explanations we're talking about the surgeon what evidence it's not in the ego goes into out this is also believe me but its just fun to take on how many things completely and utterly by them self contradictory 30 East ocean one is comments how do comets fallin towards the Sun if the solar wind is with moving things around the Sun and the pathway that, steak and perfectly explained by a gravitational Siri coming to tell species differently if I disable the wind had that effect yeah that's right shark to win the paper they say that no one's ever measured the gravitational constant so apparently they never heard of the Cavendish experiment where we are scientist measured directly measured it today haven't heard it or do you think that they're trying to send someone so they have an interactive part of their website and other people brought up some of what about the experiments and then again there's a had some response to that but it was incoherent it didn't make any sense that's just looking at the effective iron balls on each other yeah your face in but even they say they're the one on the 30 billion chance that the planets all orbit the Sun in the same direction could be the result of random chance right right right so completely ignoring it feels to be that they will all rotate the same direction because they were part of the same rotating swirling cloud of gas that collapse yeah but that's just you just focus something that happened in the past big planet nobody was here to see that happen really what they say when you see it what about the swirly discs are you decide to invent stuff that happened in the past in order to explain what's happening today Siri beautifully explains it without having to invoke the invisible forces or things that happened in the past me this is unbelievably ridiculous.
Science or Fiction (1:01:48)
Item #1. Scientists report the discovery of new lizard species, tetrahymena, that exists in seven distinct sexes. Item #2. Nature recently reported that two counterfeit scientific journals successfully scammed hundreds of researchers out of author fees. And item #3. New genetic evidence suggests that primates evolved trichromatic color vision while still nocturnal, rather than as an adaption to diurnal living, as previously believed.
S: Well let's move on, we're going to go on now with Science or Fiction.
Each week I come up with three science news items or facts, two genuine and one fictitious, then I challenge my panel of skeptics to tell me which one is the fake.
How you ready for your first signs of fiction yeah I guess so now that's the spirit haha I am love I have a love hate relationship with science fiction cause it for what to do something I don't do who is that Steely Dan things that I don't know about without researching them first is Taylor photography poker I will talk later not for long time okay here we go item number one scientist report a Discovery of a new lizard species touch your hiney NHA exists in seven distinct sex it's time to nature recently reported that to counterfeit scientific journals successfully scam hundred to researchers out of their fees hey darling three new genetic evidence suggests that primate to fall to try chromatic color vision well still nocturnal rather than as an adaptation to die in a living as previously believed Kyle as our guest to have the extreme privilege of going first si nos procedure um no good luck this the first one scientist report discovery of new lizard species exist in seven distinct sections that's an interesting one that could be kinda complicated right back atcha like his relationships how do you pair up dancers that we need one that seems so crazy you almost think theres gotta be something to it but to I like that one but let's move on to the next one nature recently reported to counterfeit Journal successfully skin hundred the researchers out of author fees that one seems very plausible ah I don't really have a problem with that one new genetic evidence suggest primates evolve Tri Tronics color vision while still nocturnal that's interesting because I always thought the color vision with pre week under low light conditions I wonder how you would evolve color vision in low light when you're mostly nocturnal show that one seems problematic but now that first one is so crazy this into steaks sexist thing if its true that'll be fasting and I need to read about that but I just have a hard time buying that one Lesters something subtle hear that I'm not thinking of I'm going to say this dih 6x is what is wrong okay pop ah I want to go now the 70s the sexes add lizards just seem to fall too complicated for that to make sense you know if it was something much more simple I could buy that some having a big problem with that one counterfeit Journal scamming yeah sure when I mean a problem could I have with that Spa be easy to do and get away with yeah see I did try to make color vision hi Bobby I drink during the the night yeah that makes no sense because color vision is essentially useless at night I which is and because the other cones are close to the phobia the right now that's why people say at night do you want to see something really sharply don't look directly at it look a little away from its of your you're on your ride coming to play for night vision and I tell you could see things more clearly at night and tonight makes no sense unless perhaps those primates you know you I guess you can you could be nocturnal but still have some minimal activity during the day and you would have a benefit to you if you have color vision on during those brief. Of time so I think I can kinda justify that I did doesn't make much sense to make a case for all of them to know what the hell I'm going to do you get your going to pick one I know sometime tonight I'm going to go to go with the scientific journal Texan okay Jay are the 17 sex is done lots of questions about this one is really provocative science fiction I don't like is it beer can only two of the other seven of them and can I can sex one in sex to only mate 63 and 64 only mate there's an odd number maybe like three of them can only make it is very complicated relationships going on it's kind of weird nature of the one
It's kind of weird nature of the one about nature reporting did the three scam journals scamming people I have no reason to doubt that throw scams all over the web site that was is absolute fact the last one about the genetic evidence that is suggesting the color vision one so between the first and last 1i think I'm going to go with the one about the lizard species is being fake okay for Becca and I really want to do a color visions perfectly helpful to nocturnal animals because there are plenty of times when its bright enough at night to see color like dust Don and full moons the counterfeit journals yes it totally makes sense we talk about craps rules all the time and they always have really fancy sounding names and is just crap and uh so I can completely believe that some having counterfeit and have made off with lots of money losers pcs Bob totally said the right answer and then I think and then continued on East you said please use the space heater too complex and maybe a smaller organism and I agree with that stops final answer Adega that so I'm going to say that the lizard species one is to fix that and heaven I'm going to go with the lizard species I'm going to say that sounds top big mistake so you angry that new genetic evidence suggests that primate evolve try chromatic color vision all still not turn on resident has an annotation to Diana living as previously believed I think that one is signs and that one is science who hey guys I'm surprising to me to go to previous studies about this is a new study looking at the genetics of tartar Sears tarsiers branched off very big is Lee from the primate tree basically yes very close to the beginning of the primate Rakesh and today for looking at their genetic freak and say something about how early primates may have look like s*** and Alice is indicated was that the end of the day haven't had a common ancestor with the rest of primates with tri chromatic vision that would suggest that try Christmas evolved to be four monkeys and apes became diarrheal and that therefore it evolved even while probably won't really probably crystal nocturnal isnt only possible interpretations vidoes strongly suggest that and Rebecca they do hypothesize what you said that rather then primate became Darnell and then that provide the selective advantage for track from a Sears card reader color vision that Prime 85 tricromes she probably because of Oz vision at Twilight or during a full moon on the temples and add to your other assholes Center nocturnal that have color vision right I remember reading before and I always thought the reason for that was because it is a useful adaptation even turn on the most other vertebrates have touched your privacy soon they just haven't figured you nocturnal just never lost character color vision ShoeMint most mammals hat and just have to pick meant but primita marsupials Family app yeah haha r have tried from see all of the mammals are died from it maybe was the other way around maybe it was the utilities fortuitous development of try chrome to see which was selected for because he will be Peter Dante Tinga full moon ur during during twilight that allowed primates to become Darnell who's to the causative factors reversed.
Did you get a teaching came first In N Out led to the ability to strip to uh to shift to more of daytime activity yesterday hit the ground running so to speak show alright Little River source let's go number two major reasons reported the to try to fit scientific journal successfully scammed hundreds of researchers out of altar fees Bob you think this one is the fiction everyone else thinks this one is sin send this one is science sorry sorry Bob sorry other stuff yeah so I know I feel bad for saying yea these for counterfeit counterfeit online web sites of real science journals counterfeit to work Justin on the Charles they were the one at Wonderland was the archives day see it science is this is published by the Society of physics and it actually is Trey of Geneva in switch 126 account if interested was 80 mocked up a website of a real journal but a journal that doesn't have its own website for paper only girls don't have a website and then they did a really good job of making it look legit it on and then they would steal authors would submit papers through the online site online with a picture on there it is it would pay the fees for the Beano to some some journals, for you don't have enough revenue to public two to 2 printing out the journals we just make all the pain feat a to publish their paper which I was not was cranky but whatever cash and then um they would take the fees and they and then there was just a conduit them I delete the editor of the real journalist it was getting enquire res from sin to say hey when's my paper going to be published in a had no idea what they were talking about and Dan on an indexing Thomson routers indexes data usage is an index of scientific publications favor by using the website in order to index published articles and discharge notice discrepancies between the Articles that were being published on the website to the website said were being published in the Charles any articles at Rex EP ring in the printer now hey bud you for a while they're actually in indexing the fake website yeah before they figured out that it was all a front row seat quickly remove that covered so for that hundreds of researchers were scammed out of their other fees and apparently they tracked the money to Armenia show the journals are trying to get the site shut down but they can't do it my not I don't know International I guess just kick it and s*** down other country is it's complicated yeah so I didn't wanna listen series even if your print only Journal you know you got a scarf up your your URL with your name on it and you gotta park a website on your brand new these retarded because they had no web presence so is a vacuum at these kind of fish were able to fill 2013 Yeah right okay so let's go number one side to support the discovery menu lizard species text me know that existed seven distinct 6.1 is the fiction but tetrahydride a does exist and it does exist in seven different sexes but its a protozoan start a blizzard the new study that inspired my fake news I what is a loser dated the genetics of the different sexes who is actually really interesting and protozoans species that is used a lot in research what they found was dad to just two genes determine which of the seven sex is an organism the one individual text your hymen it would be found out to win to touch your hiney to come together to mate At that point the essential you decide which of the seven sex is there going to be and ending mate and then there aspirin and also is this the sex of the offspring is also randomly tournament history of them yeah I see read this paper this morning and I was going to write a post about it on skype I couldn't think of the perfect joke show ended up not doing it at his other issue to scene and yes it's always check skeptic before I decide which theater is it is really cool because it's me and mines stray cat in the fact it is two different sexes making a baby and the babies sex has nothing to do with his parents sex I don't get around the parents sex stories are interesting about this species in probably why its a used frequently in genetic research said it has two nuclei well I know how it has a germline nucleus Instamatic Nicolas does the Zagg are separated out and that of that allows for experimental manipulation you can control over things been working you know you're the only some jeans are in one nucleus and other teams are in the other day hi Steve I'm going to hit you with some randomness from the road I ready okay here I go number one rated free clever I think it died sheets and alright well good job everyone the Fox River Song Bob Lorsch by Bob and Myra courage for going concern to BK good job Bob 110 carb burger the game again Dometic I.
Skeptical Quote of the Week (1:17:04)
There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn't true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true.
Søren Kierkegaard
So Jay, do you have a quote for us this week? I do have a cool quote this week this quote was sent in by listener named Jim Kelly from Austin Texas to quote is from someone named Soren Kierkegaard he was a Danish philosophers theologian poet social critic and religious author and the crew is there are two ways to be fooled one is to believe what is it true the other is to refuse to believe what is true card goodnight I get rid of this isn't for that was summer before you don't mind if you see you don't like either one is fine its just a s***** a yes and then what you're saying you're smarter than cute saying something its not sure now please ok a cute guy was walking around the mid 1800 so that yes pretty aggressive thinking maybe it's only obvious because he thought of it a long time ago yeah yeah standing on the shoulders.
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