SGUTranscripts - User contributions [en]

SGU Episode 367

2012-11-07T09:20:46Z

Tnewsome: Continues Science or Fiction

{{Editing required
|transcription = y

|time-stamps = y
|formatting = y
|links = y
|Today I Learned list = y
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{{InfoBox
|episodeTitle = SGU Episode 367
|episodeDate = 28th July 2012
|episodeIcon = File:Aura-photo.jpg
|rebecca = y
|bob = y
|jay = y
|evan = y
|downloadLink = http://media.libsyn.com/media/skepticsguide/skepticast2012-07-28.mp3
|notesLink = http://www.theskepticsguide.org/archive/podcastinfo.aspx?mid=1&pid=367
|forumLink = http://sguforums.com/index.php/topic,42726.0.html
|qowText = Homeopaths do not have a physical brain, but merely 'skull water' with the memory of brains.
|qowAuthor = [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robin_Ince Robin Ince]
|}}

== Introduction ==
''You're listening to the Skeptics' Guide to the Universe, your escape to reality.''

== This Day in Skepticism ( ) ==
* July 28, 1996: The remains of Kennewick Man was discovered

== News Items ==
=== Skeptical Conferences ( ) ===
* TAM DragonCon CSICon

=== Sally Ride ( ) ===
[http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/24/opinion/urry-sally-ride/index.html CNN: Thank you, Sally Ride]

=== Mood Photography ( ) ===
[http://theness.com/neurologicablog/index.php/mood-photography/ Neurologica Blog: Mood Photography]

=== Computer Modeling Life ( ) ===
[http://phys.org/news/2012-07-researchers-produce-first-complete-computer.html Phys.org: Researchers produce first complete computer model of an organism]

=== Artificial Jellyfish ( ) ===
[http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-18953034 BBC News: Artificial jellyfish created from heart cells]

=== Firewalk Mishap ( ) ===
[http://theness.com/neurologicablog/index.php/firewalk-mishap/ Neurologica Blog: Firewalk Mishap]

== Who's That Noisy? ( )==

== Questions and Emails ==
=== Multivitamins ( )===

== Science or Fiction (0:47:31) ==
{{transcribing
|transcriber = tnewsome
}}
(jingle)

''Voiceover: It's time for Science or Fiction''

S: Each week I come up with three science news items or facts, two real and one fake. And I challenge my panel of skeptics to tell me which one they think is the fake. You guys ready for this week?

J: Yeah.

B: Yeah.

E: Uh huh.

J: ''Oh Yeah.''

S: Oh yeah. Okay, here we go. Item number one: A new study show that while multitasking a visual task with an audio task—such as driving while talking on the phone—significantly impairs performance, combining two visual tasks had little effect. Item number two: Scientists have identified a new syndrome—delayed severe allergic reaction to red meat caused by a tick bite. And item number three: Researchers have found a distinct subsystem for smell in the mouse that is likely dedicated to smelling behaviorally important odors, such as fear. Bob, go first.

B: Uh, oh boy, wow. You know you read news items— I don't know where you pull these from. Ummm.

S: And you never will (laughs), ''if I can help it!'' Imagine how hard my job would be if you knew where I'm going for my stupid news items.

B: Ha, ha. Alright a new study shows that while multitasking a visual test with an audio task impairs performance like we've heard before, but combing two visuals had little effect. Uh man, you know, I'm just not, I'm just not buying that. Cause all the studies I've read, not recently, but we've talked about it enough, they really didn't distinguish that. And I would think that, I would think that if you had two visual tasks, I mean, the idea of going back and forth, you know, would kind of the same as, you know, multitasking at work. You're going from one task to another, to the other and it's just never as good as just sticking to the one for a while. Umm, hmm. Let's see. Got a new syndrome here, delayed severe allergic reaction to red meat caused by a tick bite. ''Damn.'' I have no idea what to say about that. I can't think of anything that would get any red flags. Oh geez, I don't know. Let's see what the third one is. Distinct subsystem for smell in the mouse dedicated to things like fear. Umm, bsch-yeah, I guess, that's possible. When a creature is experiencing fear there could be some sort of release of something that would be identifiable and associated with fear— I guess. Two visual tasks. Alright, I'm gonna say the multitasking one. Umm, I'm— I still think that even if it's two visual tasks that multitasking there will be some impairment going on, because that. So yeah, I'll say that ones fiction.

S: Okay, and Rebecca?

R: Okay, the multitasking item reminds me of something I read ages ago that showed that talking on a cell phone while driving impairs your ability to drive safely much, much than carrying on a conversation with someone who is in the car with you. Which at the time, I think, was attributed to the fact that you don't have to guess at the other person's emotions and things when they're in the car with you. But you are using your sight. Uhh, so, more so, than you would on the cell phone. So, because of that, that item rings true to me. That, uhh, audio is more demanding for us than visuals. Sooo, tentatively I'm saying that one makes sense. "Allergic reaction to red meat caused by a tick bite", I haven't, I only recently learned that you can have allergic reactions to meat. I didn't realize that was a thing. But I know that is a thing now so I'm more likely to believe that than I might have previously. Caused by a tick bite? Yeah, I mean, I guess see, maybe, you know you have a certain immune response to a tick bite that also cause an allergy that you didn't have before. So that one makes sense too. The one, the one that's not making sense is the idea that mice have a dedicated area for, a dedicated subsystem for smelling fear because, mostly because behaviorally important odors such as fear, that's what bugs me because I don't understand how smelling fear in another animal is important to mouse at all. Like mice are just scared of everything, all the time. Right? Like why would they care if the cat that's after them is afraid of something. Suddenly they are gonna turn around and charge the cat? No, that's not gonna happen. I've never seen that happen. All I've ever seen is mice running for their dear little lives. So, I can't see any reason for the mouse to have the ability to detect fear in other animals. So, that one, I'm gonna say is the fiction.

S: Okay, Evan?

E: Well, let's have a look. Umm, the multitasking one, we've spoken quite a few times on the show about multitasking. Umm, but specifically, visual task with an audio task? I'm not sure we've phrased it in a specific context such as this. So, umm, it's very interesting. Significantly impairs performance, combining two visual effects had little effect. ''Two visual tasks had little effect.'' Well, driving is a visual task, what else would I be doing while I'm driving? Visual task, well— ''texting is a visual task.'' Kinda thinking that, I mean, well that's other tasks as well but certainly visuals a main component of that. Uhh, hhm, I'm not sure about that one. Umm, the second one the new syndrome. Severe— ''delayed'' severe allergic reaction to red meat. And the tick bites the carrier? So apparently what's happening here is that the tick bite carries something in it's saliva? Little tick's saliva? That gets into your system, through the blood and causes you to have an allergic reaction to red meat? Is the anything— I can't—I'm trying to think of what else to kinda equate this to. But I can't think of an example off the top of my head. (sucks breath) So, moving one to the last one. Mi— I mean— uhh. Mice that have a distinct subsystem for smell? That smells behavioral[ly] important odors as fear. I'm thinking that that one's— of the three— I kinda think that that one probably is the most likely to be true. You know, they find all kinds of cool things about mice. Mice are the classic test animal. But a distinct subsystem. Uhh, I'm not sure, that one seems to make a lot of sense to me in a certain way. Umm, Rebecca, you were talking about how mice are kinda fearful and skittish of everything and I think that actually plays into, uhh, why they may have a subsystem for it that they detect it. So, it's between, for me, multitasking or the tick bite and allergy. (sucks breath) Uhh, well, I don't like the two visual tasks having little effect. I don't know about that, I think you really gotta keep your eyes on the road, that's the bottom line. So, I'll say that that one's the fiction.

J: That a boy!

S: (drowsily) I'm sorry, which one?

E: The multitasking is the fiction.

S: I'm, I was doing something else.

(laughter)

S: Alright, Jay?

E: Ha, ha, ha.

J: I'm gonna go in reverse order. I absolutely think the one about the mice smelling fear— being wired to smell fear. Sure, that makes a lot of sense to me. I'm curious to know—

R: Seriously?

J: Yeah, just.

R: Just me?

J: Well, you know, I don't want to throw out the big pheromone thing. I mean it's like people throw that word around like, you know, it explains all these different things or whatever. But absolutely, you know, ''sure'' they could smell— you know, you were talking about the cat as a predator and all that and, sure, why wouldn't they be able to smell it. Smell things that the animal is putting off, whatever. Yeah, that makes sense. The one about the red meat caused by tick bites, the allergy situation. The only thing about that one I don't like is the word "delayed". Like a "delayed sever allergic reaction". Why would it be delayed? It's very strange. I hate ticks and I hate being bitten by ticks and I hate everything to do with them. And I think we should try to destroy all ticks and bedbugs. But anyway, I don't know about this one, I mean, what have I got to say other than it's weird and I hope that that one's the fiction. But the one that I didn't like from the moment that I heard it— that's why I went in reverse order— is this whole hoo-hah about combing visual tasks has little effect, that's BS. Combining visual tasks, meaning two different things you have to visually keep track of at the same time, that one is the fiction by ''far.'' Is the fiction. Thank-you.

S: Okay.

J: Thank-you.

S: Alright. So—

R: I'm alone in here? I can't believe I'm the only—like, uh!

S: (dryly) You're alone.

J: ''A-looone!''

R: Immediately the mouse one.

S: You're alone. Jay, what about bed ticks? What do you feel about them?

J: ''Oh my God.'' Imagine if there were pen ticks! (laughs) ''Oh my God. No!''

R: Dear Lord, no. Something new to be scared of.

E:

S: Alright. You all agree that scientists have identified a new syndrome, a delayed sever allergic reaction to red meat caused by a tick bite. You all think that one is science. And that one is (pauses)— science.

J: Uh, why is it delayed?

R: Yay!

J: Why delayed?

S: I don't know. But it's the first one. It's the first delayed [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anaphylaxis anaphylactic], or severe allergic, reaction that has been identified.

E: Wow.

S: Uh, this is a study, really a case series, where they identified two patients that the same syndrome. They were all bitten by the [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lone_Star_Tick lone star tick] and had a—

R: How ironic, given the [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lone_Star_Steakhouse Lone Star Steakhouse].

S: Yeah. So the—

E: Ha, ha, ha. Sorry. I like that.

S: The tick has a specific carbohydrate that produces an immune response. The same carbohydrate is in the red meat, meat derived from mammals, so can produce a secondary or an anaphylactic severe allergic reaction. There are a couple of firsts here. This is the first identified anaphylactic reaction to a non-protein, to a carbohydrate. It's the first delayed reaction, 6-8 hours delayed after eating the meat. So, like you have a steak dinner and then in the middle of the night you wake up and can't breathe.

J: Yikes.

S: Yeah.

J: Ticks really suck.

S: Triggered by a tick bite! Yeah, that's cool. It's very interesting.

J: I mean, seriously—

S: Imagine how hard it is to make ''that'' diagnosis. But they're saying that if there are physicians in this part of the world, bits of the south-west, and patients present with an anaphylactic reaction after consuming red meat you should consider this newly identified syndrome. Very interesting. There are a lot of new things in there. Umm, let's go back to number 1: A new study shows that while multitasking a visual task with an audio task, such as driving while talking on the phone, significantly impairs performance, combining two visual tasks had little effect. Bob, Jay and Evan, you all think this one is the fiction.

S: And Rebecca—

E: (resignedly) Uhh.

S: (continues) You think this one is science.

R: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Press_Your_Luck No whammy], no whammy, no whammy.

E: This is it.

S: This one is—

E: I mean, this is it, right?

J: Oh—

S: (continues) The fiction!

E, B, J: (collective joyous moaning)

S: It was fiction! I suppose you could have thought that maybe, like, if you were integrating two visual into one, sort of, meta-visual task that wouldn't be multitasking but— no, no. Uhh, but no. It did in fact— the study showed that combining two visual tasks is even worse. Has ''more'' of a negative effect

S: (continues) That was the way to go with this one.

J: Thank you.

R: Ewwwh.

B: C'mon, it was obvious.

E: Wow. (cat noise)

S: They used eye tracking technology to see how the subjects were handling the tasks that they were given but also their performance on the task.
And, yeah, when trying to combine two visual tasks their performance greatly suffered. The other interesting wrinkle here though is that when asked how they did, the people who were trying to multitask two visual tasks thought that they did better than when trying to multitask a visual and an audio task, even though they did worse. So they had a false sense of security, if you will, with the two visual tasks. So they were trying to model what would be worse, talking on the cell phone while driving or texting while driving. And definitely, texting while driving is much worse.

J: That's odd.

S: Kind of seems intuitive to me. I mean, you are visually distracted while trying to text.

R: Yeah, but, and you're using your fingers.

S: Yeah, although I don't—

S: I don't think that's the component though, the problem.

R: Really?

S: It's just the distraction. The diminishing of attention. You have to look away from the road to text. You brought up the previous data that shows that it's more distracting to talk on the phone than to someone who's sitting next to you in the car. We've brought this up before, you know, there's speculation about why that might be. There's the extra set of eyes, (do they) compensate for the distraction somewhat? My personal experience is that I find it really hard to talk on a cell phone, in that is takes a certain amount of concentration because the cell phone companies typically give just enough bandwidth so that human speech is recognizable. But not a lot more than that. So they are always restraining the bandwidth and I just find the audio quality, even as phones get better, the audio quality is really such that I really have to pay attention to understand what the person is saying over the cell phone.

R: Yeah.

S: Do you guys find that too?

J: No!

R: Yeah, I guess. I don't drive.

J: Ahhhh!

E: Yeah, that's right.

J: No, I don't agree with you.

S: And now we've got to use the the hands-free devices and some crappy ear phone, you're not even holding the phone up to your head. It's even harder.

J: What do you mean, it's harder?

E: It's harder. The voice, the sound quality is worse with the hands-free ear buds.

J: My head phones are epic. I have [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bose_Corporation Bose] headphones

[http://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/twovisual.htm Item number 1]: A new study shows that while multitasking a visual task with an audio task, such as driving while talking on the phone, significantly impairs performance, combining two visual tasks had little effect. [http://www.springer.com/about+springer/media/springer+select?SGWID=0-11001-6-1384244-0 Item number 2]: Scientists have identified a new syndrome - delayed severe allergic reaction to red meat caused by a tick bite. [http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2012-07/bu-mhd072312.php Item number 3]: Researchers have found a distinct subsytem for smell in the mouse that is likely dedicated to smelling behaviorally important odors, such as fear.

== Skeptical Quote of the Week (1:07:11) ==
<blockquote>Homeopaths do not have a physical brain, but merely 'skull water' with the memory of brains.</blockquote>
Robin Ince

== Announcements ( ) ==
{{Outro1}}

== References ==
<references/>

{{Navigation}}

SGU Episode 367

2012-10-24T11:49:14Z

Tnewsome: Transcription of Science or Fiction continued.

SGU Episode 367

2012-10-22T09:59:59Z

Tnewsome: Started transcription.

5X5 Episode 31

2012-10-22T01:14:09Z

Tnewsome: Added reference for Plavix

{{Template:5X5 infobox 
|episodeID = 5X5 Episode 31
|Contents = Digital Homeopathy
|episodeDate = 4th August 2008
|verified = y
|rebecca = y
|jay = y
|evan = y
|guest1 = M: Mike Lacelle
|downloadLink = http://media.libsyn.com/media/sgu5x5/SGU5x52008-08-04.mp3
|notesLink = http://www.theskepticsguide.org/archive/podcastinfo.aspx?mid=2&pid=31
|forumLink = http://sguforums.com/index.php/topic,12881.0.html
|}}
== Digital Homeopathy 20 years after Benveniste ==
{{5x5intro}}

S: This is the SGU 5X5 and tonight we are talking about [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy homeopathy]. This is 20th anniversary of the seminal scientific paper in 1988 written by [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_Benveniste Jacques Benveniste] and published in the journal [http://www.nature.com/nature/index.html Nature], which has sparked a tremendous amount of controversy within scientific circles.<ref>Davenas E, Beauvais F, Amara J, et al. (June 1988). "Human basophil degranulation triggered by very dilute antiserum against IgE". Nature 333 (6176): 816–8. doi:10.1038/333816a0. [http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2455231 PubMed abstract]</ref> The study did not convince the scientific community that homeopathy – which is the dilution of remedies beyond the point of there being any original substance left behind – did not convince them that homeopathy worked or was plausible. What it did do was reveal a great deal of poor science and even fraud in Jacques Benveniste's lab.

R: Yeah, and the sad thing is that even though there was a whole team of scientists and [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Randi James Randi] who went out there and figured out what was going on in the lab, which was that lab assistants were affecting the– changing the samples. Even though it was thoroughly investigated at the time and proven to be a faulty experiment, it ''still'' has inspired so much crap! People still buy into homeopathy.

J: I was surprised that [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DARPA DARPA], the Defense Advanced Research Project Agency, that's brought some incredible innovations to the world of the military and, of course, home consumers, they even studied some of these claims and they came to the conclusion, there's a quote here: "Our team found no replicable effects from digital signals"<ref>
Jonas, W. B., Ives, J. A., Rollwagen, F., et al. (2006). "Can specific biological signals be digitized?". The FASEB journal, 20(1), 23-28. [http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16394263 PubMed abstract]; [http://www.fasebj.org/content/20/1/23.long Full text]</ref>

S: Yeah, that was one of Benveniste's real legacies is that he came up with this idea that you could digitize homeopathic remedies and then email them across the world through the internet and then the healing power of the remedy will be – of the digitized remedy – could then be transferred into fresh water at the other end. That takes the ridiculous to ''whole'' new levels.

E: A digital homeopathy sufferer kit costs about a thousand dollars. And you can start treating yourselves and others if you go ahead and buy this kit and start making up your own homeopathic remedies. Just a way of, a modern way of, selling a very old idea using the web and the internet to come up with just a new scheme of making money.

S: Uh huh. Right.

J: A thousand dollars!

S: I love the diagram they have on this one website about digital homeopathy.<ref>StreamingRemedies.com [http://www.digitalsoundremedies.com/digital_homeopathy.htm Digital Homeopathy] (scroll down to "How are remedies digitized?" for diagram)</ref> It's supposed to illustrate how it works.
<blockquote>Step 1: The remedy or substance is placed into the chamber.
 Step 2: Vibrational energy travels to the amplifier.</blockquote>
S: Vibrational energy!

E: Vibrational energy.

S: (continues quote)
<blockquote>Step 3: Amplified signal is sent to the computer and for using a computer sound card and software the vibrational signature is saved as a sound file.</blockquote>

M: Step 5: Profit!

S: And then all you have to do is...

J: Hah, hah, hah.

S: Yeah and step five is extract money from wallet!

E: Cash check

S: Uhh, unbelievable. It is just ''magic''. It is pure and simple magic, but they couch it in scientific sounding terminology.

M: You could take this to the next level and instead of pharmacies you'll have digital pharmacies. You get your [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clopidogrel Plavix] though your iPod or something like that.

S: Uh huh.

M: It's just, it's kind of silly. Obviously. You could just even take it to the ''next'' level and get some pizza through your USB port. Which would be pretty awesome!

R: Homeopathic pizza? Not so good.

S: Homeopathic pizza, yeah. So this is part of a new category of marketing scams. I mean, who doesn't want to sell electrons? Right? For money! You're selling people just digital files. They cost you nothing to make or reproduce. So if you could sell just the ''idea'' that with sound waves or specific sights or sounds that you could have a healing effect, or some kind of magical effect. Man, that is the ultimate pay day for scam artists because they don't even have to have a physical product.

J: Bits, not atoms.

S: That's right.

E: Now, where does an organization, like the [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FDA Food and Drug Administration] or somebody, step in and look into this? And try to put a stop to it?

S: Well as long as they use enough weasel words and don't specifically claim to treat or cure a disease the FDA has no jurisdiction. The [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Trade_Commission Federal Trade Commission] can go after them for false advertising. But, again, they just have to be careful in how they say it. Oftentimes, FTC fines amount to a slap on the wrist to the cost of doing business. They have been more effective recently, trying to crack down on stuff like this but the scam artists can easily just stay a couple of steps ahead of them. And there are just so much profit to be had selling nonsense and false hope that the existing regulation is just not adequate to deal with it.

E: So what's to stop us, Steve, from announcing that all of a sudden we're going to start to broadcast homeopathic transmissions on AM carriers. And all you have to do is turn in, tune in your AM radio to a specific frequency at a specific time, hold a glass of water next to it and there you go! You'll have your homeopathic remedy. Is there ''anything'' stopping anybody from doing something like that?

S: Uhh... ethics?

(laughter)

S: The fact that we are not evil, comes to mind.

J: So why not cut out the middle man, listen to it directly and have it imprint on the copious amounts of water in the human body?

S: Well that's what they're doing, you put the headphones on and heal while you relax. To a digital homeopathic tune.

E: We have entered the [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Twilight_Zone Twilight Zone].

{{5x5outro}}

== References ==
<references/>

{{5X5 Navigation}}
{{5X5 categories
|Homeopathy = y
|Cons, Scams & Hoaxes = y
|Pseudoscience = y
}}

User talk:Teleuteskitty

2012-10-21T14:30:20Z

Tnewsome:

Thank you. Wasn't sure of topic for 5x5 100 - I put 'general science' but it's more scientific method or principles.

----

Thanks for fixing up my transcription :-) and for the warm welcome--[[User:jonaskoelker|jonaskoelker]] ([[User talk:jonaskoelker|talk]]) 13:43, 14 October 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for the welcome :-) --[[User:Gugarte|Gugarte]] ([[User talk:Gugarte|talk]]) 04:37, 16 October 2012 (UTC)

I have no clear idea of how to communicate with people on this platform, but I'm going to try this way and see what happens. If I get yelled at, then I'll get yelled at! Anyway...thank you for your help! I'm trying to wrap my head around how this whole wiki thing works. I only need you guys to have a little patience! :)
I will see if I can make myself read through all of the instructions.
Thanks again!

I really have no idea how to communicate on Wiki, but only this makes sense right now... thank you for helping me with SGU 5X5 #12! I am trying very hard do learn how to post these transcriptions.
Dasaratha

Also trued adding SGU 5X5 #18, but I have no idea how to create a new edit page for the this episode... could you please tell me what can I do?--[[User:Dasaratha|Dasaratha]] ([[User talk:Dasaratha|talk]])

I finally managed to figure it out :)))) Thank you very much for all your help! --[[User:Dasaratha|Dasaratha]] ([[User talk:Dasaratha|talk]])

Thanks for advice. Real new to this and trying to figure it out as I go. All advice useful. Trying my first part of a real SGU episode next. --[[User:Tnewsome|Tnewsome]] ([[User talk:Tnewsome|talk]]) 13:36 22nd October 2012 (EST)

Talk:5X5 Episode 31

2012-10-21T14:17:12Z

Tnewsome: Created page with "Couldn't find the original Nature Benveniste reference. It may have been retracted?"

Couldn't find the original Nature Benveniste reference. It may have been retracted?

SGU Episode 367

2012-10-21T10:15:35Z

Tnewsome:

Template:5X5 episode list

2012-10-21T09:41:41Z

Tnewsome:

<noinclude>This template is used to display the list of 5X5 episodes on the [[Main Page]] and the [[5X5 Episodes]] page. Additions and amendments to this template will be reflected on those pages.

For help on how to add a new row, see [[Template:5X5 list entry]].
</noinclude>

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|contents = Skepticism 101 - Slippery Slope/Post Hoc
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|date = Jan 13 2011
|contents = Testable
|category1 = General Science
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 99
|date = Jan 5 2011
|contents = Graphology
|category1 = History
|category2 = Pseudoscience
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 98
|date = Dec 30 2010
|contents = Harry Houdini
|category1 = History
|category2 = Paranormal
|category3 = Ghosts & Demons
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 97
|date = Dec 20 2010
|contents = Repressed Memories
|category1 = Neuroscience & Psychology
|category2 = Science & Medicine
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 96
|date = Nov 9 2010
|contents = Magnets
|category1 = General Science
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 95
|date = Sep 21 2010
|contents = Chelation
|category1 = Science & Medicine
|category2 = Alternative Medicine
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 94
|date = Sep 12 2010
|contents = Nostradamus
|category1 = Prophecy
|category2 = History
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 93
|date = Aug 13 2010
|contents = Chiropractic - Part 3
|category1 = Science & Medicine
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 92
|date = Jul 28 2010
|contents = Chiropractic - Part 2
|category1 = Science & Medicine
|category2 = History
|category3 = Legal Issues & Regulations
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 91
|date = Jul 13 2010
|contents = Chiropractic - Part 1
|category1 = Science & Medicine
|category2 = History
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 90
|date = Jun 29 2010
|contents = The Unification Church
|category1 = Religion & Faith
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 83
|date = Dec 20 2009
|contents = Irreducible Complexity
|category1 = Creationism & ID
|category2 = Nature & Evolution
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 81
|date = Nov 18 2009
|contents = Naturopathy
|category1 = Alternative Medicine
|category2 = Science & Medicine
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 80
|date = Oct 28 2009
|contents = Polygraphs
|category1 = Technology
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = incomplete
|episode = 75
|date = Aug 12 2009
|contents = The Coriolis Effect
|category1 = General Science
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 72
|date = Jul 16 2009
|contents = Randi Million Dollar Psychic Challenge and Connie Sonne
|category1 = Pseudoscience
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 68
|date = May 22 2009
|contents = Near Death Experiences
|category1 = Myths & Misconceptions
|category2 = Science & Medicine
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 67
|date = Apr 30 2009
|contents = Skepticism 101 - Special Pleading
|category1 = Logic & Philosophy
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 65
|date = Apr 16 2009
|contents = Skepticism 101 - Scientific Theory
|category1 = General Science
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 62
|date = Mar 19 2009
|contents = Skepticism 101 - How to Argue
|category1 = Logic & Philosophy
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 56
|date = Feb 4 2009
|contents = Probability
|category1 = General Science
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 55
|date = Jan 28 2009
|contents = Skepticism 101 - Poisoning the Well
|category1 = Logic & Philosophy
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 54
|date = Jan 21 2009
|contents = Skepticism 101 - False Dichotomy
|category1 = Logic & Philosophy
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 53
|status = verified
|date = Jan 13 2009
|contents = Anecdotal Evidence
|category1 = Myths & Misconceptions
|category2 = Logic & Philosophy
|category3 = General Science
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 52
|date = Jan 6 2009
|contents = Atlantis
|category1 = Myths & Misconceptions
|category2 = Logic & Philosophy
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 50
|date = Dec 15 2008
|contents = Skepticism 101 - The Argument from Ignorance
|category1 = Logic & Philosophy
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 49
|date = Dec 8 2008
|contents = Skepticism 101 - Argument from Authority
|category1 = Logic & Philosophy
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 48
|date = Dec 1 2008
|contents = The 10% Brain Myth
|category1 = Myths & Misconceptions
|category2 = General Science
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 46
|date = Nov 18 2008
|contents = Skepticism 101 - Correlation and Causation
|category1 = General Science
|category2 = Logic & Philosophy
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 45
|date = Nov 11 2008
|contents = Chi and other forms of vitalism
|category1 = Energy Healing
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 43
|date = Oct 29 2008
|contents = Holocaust Denial
|category1 = Myths & Misconceptions
|category2 = History

}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 38
|date = Sep 24 2008
|contents = Skepticism 101 - Pareidolia
|category1 = Nature & Evolution
|category2 = Neuroscience & Psychology
|category3 = Paranormal
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 31
|date = Aug 4 2008
|contents = Digital Homeopathy 20 years after Benveniste
|category1 = Alternative Medicine
|category2 = Science & Medicine
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 30
|date = Jul 29 2008
|contents = Evaluation of a UCONN study of therapeutic touch on bone cells in culture
|category1 = Alternative Medicine
|category2 = New Age
|category3 = Science & Medicine
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 28
|date = July 13 2008
|contents = Exposing the logical fallacy of equating faith healing with medical care.
|category1 = Logic & Philosophy
|category2 = Pseudoscience
|category3 = Science & Medicine
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = incomplete
|episode = 26
|date = June 29 2008
|contents = New study sheds light on genetic vs environmental contributions to sexuality.
|category1 = Science & Medicine
|category2 = Nature & Evolution
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 25
|date = June 22 2008
|contents = NASA Plans Probe to the Sun.
|category1 = Astronomy & Space Science
|category2 = Technology
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 24
|date = June 15 2008
|contents = New strategy for SETI - The Search for ExtraTerrestrial Intelligence.
|category1 = Astronomy & Space Science
|category2 = Technology
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 23
|date = June 08 2008
|contents = Lame car design analogy to intelligent design from the Discovery Institute.
|category1 = Creationism & ID
|category2 = Logic & Philosophy
|category3 = Nature & Evolution
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 22
|date = June 01 2008
|contents = Researchers allow monkey to control robotic arm with its mind.
|category1 = Technology
|category2 = Neuroscience & Psychology
|category3 = Science & Medicine
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 21
|date = May 25 2008
|contents = Family claims women miraculously brought back to life after rigor mortis
|category1 = Science & Medicine
|category2 = Science & the Media
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 20
|date = May 18 2008
|contents = SPAM Chainletter e-mails do not spread as virally as thought
|category1 = Technology
|category2 = Cons, Scams & Hoaxes
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 19
|date = May 11 2008
|contents = The Science of Science Fiction Movies
|category1 = Entertainment
|category2 = General Science
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 18
|date = May 4 2008
|contents = Man Regenerates Finger - Bad Science News Reporting
|category1 = Science & the Media
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 17
|date = Apr 27 2008
|contents = T-Rex proteins closely related to chickens
|category1 = Nature & Evolution
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 16
|date = Apr 20 2008
|contents = Surgery under hypnosis.
|category1 = Science & Medicine
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = incomplete
|episode = 15
|date = Apr 13 2008
|contents = Examining a fossilized snake - with legs.
|category1 = Nature & Evolution
|category2 = Creationism & ID
|category3 = General Science
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 14
|date = Apr 6 2008
|contents = Nomophobia - the fear of being out of cell phone range.
|category1 = Science & Medicine
|category2 = Technology
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 13
|date = Mar 30 2008
|contents = Man convicted of molestation claims he was raped by Bigfoot
|category1 = Cryptozoology
|category2 = Legal Issues & Regulations
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 12
|date = Mar 23 2008
|contents = Faith-healing cult leads to child death from medical neglect
|category1 = Alternative Medicine
|category2 = Energy Healing
|category3 = Religion & Faith
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 11
|date = Mar 16 2008
|contents = Art project to give the city of Portland, Oregon acupuncture
|category1 = Alternative Medicine
|category2 = Energy Healing
|category3 = Entertainment
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 10
|status = verified
|date = Mar 9 2008
|contents = Steven Spielberg to create new paranormal online community
|category1 = Paranormal
|category2 = Entertainment
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 9
|status = verified
|date = Mar 2 2008
|contents = An Emmy award winning actress and her 911 conspiracy theory
|category1 = Conspiracy Theories
|category2 = Entertainment
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 8
|status = verified
|date = Feb 23 2008
|contents = Cryptozoology - Hunting for the Thunderbird
|category1 = Cryptozoology
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 7
|status = verified
|date = Feb 17 2008
|contents = Proposed center for exorcism in Poland
|category1 = Ghosts & Demons
|category2 = Religion & Faith
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|episode = 6
|status = verified
|date = Feb 11 2008
|contents = Dr. Harris's Pain Relief Snake Oil Infomercial
|category1 = Cons, Scams & Hoaxes
|category2 = Alternative Medicine
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 5
|date = Feb 3 2008
|contents = Pope Benedict XVI takes on science
|category1 = Religion & Faith
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 4
|date = Jan 28 2008
|contents = Do celebrity deaths come in threes? The rogues take on numerology
|category1 = Myths & Misconceptions
|category2 = Paranormal
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 3
|date = Jan 21 2008
|contents = Multilevel Marketing and Pyramid Schemes
|category1 = Cons, Scams & Hoaxes
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 2
|date = Jan 13 2008
|contents = Ghost Photographs
|category1 = Paranormal
|category2 = Ghosts & Demons
}}
|-
{{5X5 list entry
|status = verified
|episode = 1
|date = Jan 6 2008
|contents = The National Health Service of the UK plans to regulate alternative medicine
|category1 = Alternative Medicine
|category2 = Pseudoscience
}}
|}

5X5 Episode 31

2012-10-21T09:38:27Z

Tnewsome:

{{5X5 editing required 
|proof-reading = y 
|}}
{{Template:5X5 infobox 
|episodeID = 5X5 Episode 31
|Contents = Digital Homeopathy
|episodeDate = 4th August 2008
|rebecca = y
|jay = y
|evan = y
|guest1 = M: Mike Lacelle
|downloadLink = http://media.libsyn.com/media/sgu5x5/SGU5x52008-08-04.mp3
|notesLink = http://www.theskepticsguide.org/archive/podcastinfo.aspx?mid=2&pid=31
|forumLink = http://sguforums.com/index.php/topic,12881.0.html
|}}

== Digital Homeopathy 20 years after Benveniste ==

{{5x5intro}}

S: This is the SGU 5X5 and tonight we are talking about [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy homeopathy]. This is 20th anniversary of the seminal scientific paper in 1988 written by [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_Benveniste Jacques Benveniste] and published in the journal [http://www.nature.com/nature/index.html Nature], which has parked a tremendous amount of controversy within scientific circles. The study did not convince the scientific community that homeopathy, which is the dilution of remedies beyond the point of there being any original substance left behind, did not convince them that homeopathy worked or was plausible. What it did do was reveal a great deal of poor science and even fraud in Jacques Benveniste's lab.

R: Yeah, and the sad thing is that even though there was a whole team of scientists and [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Randi James Randi] who went out there and figured out what was going on in the lab, which was that lab assistants were effecting the (clarifies) changing the samples. Even though it was thoroughly investigated at the time and proven to be a faulty experiment, it's still inspired so much crap! People still buy into homeopathy.

J: I was surprised that [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DARPA DARPA], the Defense Advanced Research Project Agency, that's brought some incredible innovations to the world of the military and, of course, home consumers, they even studied some of these claims and they came to the conclusion, there's a quote here:

<blockquote>Our team found no replicable effects from digital signals</blockquote>

S: Yeah, that was one of Benveniste's real legacies is that he came up with this idea that you could digitize homeopathic remedies and then email them across the world through the internet and then the healing power of the remedy will be, of the digitized remedy, could then be transferred into fresh water at the other end. That takes the ridiculous to whole new levels.

E: A digital homeopathy sufferer kit costs about a thousand dollars. And you can start treating yourselves and others if you go ahead and buy this kit and start making up your own homeopathic remedies. Just a way of, a modern way of, selling a very old idea using the web and the internet to come up with a new scheme of making money.

S: Uh huh. Right.

J: A thousand dollars!

S: I love the diagram they have on this one website of a digital homeopathy. It's supposed to illustrate how it works.

<blockquote>Step 1: The remedy or substance is placed in to the chambers.
 Step 2: Vibrational energy travels to the amplifier.</blockquote>

Vibrational energy!

E: Vibrational energy.

S: (continues quote)
<blockquote>Step 3: Amplified signal is sent to the computer and for using a computer sound card and software the vibrational signature is saved as a sound file.</blockquote>

M: Step 5: Profit!

S: And then all you have to do is...

J: Hah, hah, hah.

S: Yeah and step five is extract money from moi! Uhh, unbelievable. It is just magic. It is pure and simple magic but they couch it in scientific sounding terminology.

M: You could take this to the next level and instead of pharmacies you'll have digital pharmacies. You get your plavix though your iPod or something like that.

S: Uh huh.

M: It's just, it's kind of silly. Obviously. You could even take it to the next level and get some pizza through your USB port. Which would be pretty awesome!

R: Homeopathic pizza? Not so good.

S: Homeopathic pizza, yeah. So this is part of a new category of marketing scams. I mean, who doesn't want to sell electrons? Right? For money! You sell people just digital files. They cost you nothing to make or reproduce. So if you could sell just the idea that with sound waves or specific sights or sounds that you could have a healing effect or some kind of magical effect. Man, that is the ultimate pay day for scam artists because they don't even have to have a physical product.

J: Bits, not atoms.

S: That's right.

E: Now, where does an organization, like the [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FDA Food and Drug Administration] or somebody, step in and look into this? And try to put a stop to it?

S: Well as long as they use enough weasel words and don't specifically claim to treat or cure a disease the FDA has no jurisdiction. The [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Trade_Commission Federal Trade Commission] can go after them for false advertising. But, again, they just have to be careful in how they say it. Oftentimes, FTC fines amount to a slap on the wrist to the cost of doing business. They have been more effective recently on trying to crack down on stuff like this but the scam artists can easily just stay one or two steps ahead of them. And there are just so much profit to be had selling nonsense and false hope that the existing regulation is just not adequate to deal with it.

E: So what's to stop us, Steve, from announcing that all of a sudden we're going to start to broadcast homeopathic transmissions on AM carriers. And all you have to do is turn in, tune in your AM radio to a specific frequency at a specific time, hold a glass of water next to it and there you go! You'll have your homeopathic remedy. Is there anything stopping anybody from doing something like that?

S: Uhh... ethics?

(laughter)

S: (continues) The fact that we are not evil, comes to mind.

J: So why not cut out the middle man, listen to it directly and have it imprint on the copious amounts of water in the human body?

S: Well that's what they're doing, you put the headphones on and heal while you relax. To a digital homeopathic tune.

E: We have entered the [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Twilight_Zone Twilight Zone].

{{5x5outro}}

{{5X5 Navigation}}

{{5X5 categories
|Alternative Medicine = y
|Science & Medicine = y
}}

5X5 Episode 31

2012-10-21T02:40:03Z

Tnewsome:

{{5X5 editing required 
|proof-reading = y 
|}}
{{Template:5X5 infobox 
|episodeID = 5X5 Episode 31
|Contents = Digital Homeopathy
|episodeDate = 4th August 2008
|rebecca = y
|jay = y
|evan = y
|guest1 = M: Mike Lacelle
|downloadLink = http://media.libsyn.com/media/sgu5x5/SGU5x52008-08-04.mp3
|notesLink = http://www.theskepticsguide.org/archive/podcastinfo.aspx?mid=2&pid=31
|forumLink = http://sguforums.com/index.php/topic,12881.0.html
|}}

== Digital Homeopathy 20 years after Benveniste ==

{{5x5intro}}

S: This is the SGU 5X5 and tonight we are talking about [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy homeopathy]. This is 20th anniversary of the seminal scientific paper in 1988 written by [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_Benveniste Jacques Benveniste] and published in the journal [http://www.nature.com/nature/index.html Nature], which has parked a tremendous amount of controversy within scientific circles. The study did not convince the scientific community that homeopathy, which is the dilution of remedies beyond the point of there being any original substance left behind, did not convince them that homeopathy worked or was plausible. What it did do was reveal a great deal of poor science and even fraud in Jacques Benveniste's lab.

R: Yeah, and the sad thing is that even though there was a whole team of scientists and [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Randi James Randi] who went out there and figured out what was going on in the lab, which was that lab assistants were effecting the (clarifies) changing the samples. Even though it was thoroughly investigated at the time and proven to be a faulty experiment, it's still inspired so much crap! People still buy into homeopathy.

J: I was surprised that [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DARPA DARPA], the Defense Advanced Research Project Agency, that's brought some incredible innovations to the world of the military and, of course, home consumers, they even studied some of these claims and they came to the conclusion, there's a quote here:

<blockquote>Our team found no replicable effects from digital (mumbles)</blockquote>


S: Yeah, that was one of Benveniste's real legacies is that he came up with this idea that you could digitize homeopathic remedies and then email them across the world through the internet and then the healing power of the remedy will be, of the digitized remedy, could then be transferred into fresh water at the other end. That takes the ridiculous to whole new levels.

E: A digital homeopathy sufferer kit costs about a thousand dollars. And you can start treating yourselves and others if you go ahead and buy this kit this kit and start making up your own homeopathic remedies. Just a way of, a modern way of, selling a very old idea using the web and the internet to come up with a new scheme of making money.

S: Uh huh. Right.

J: A thousand dollars!

S: I love the diagram they have on this one website of a digital homeopathy. It's supposed to illustrate how it works.

<blockquote>Step 1: The remedy or substance is placed in to the chambers.
 Step 2: Vibrational energy travels to the amplifier.</blockquote>

Vibrational energy!

E: Vibrational energy.

S:
<blockquote>Step 3: Amplified signal is sent to the computer and for using a computer sound card and software the vibrational signature is saved as a sound file.</blockquote>

M: Step 5: Profit!

S: And then all you have to do is...

J: Hah, hah, hah.

S: Yeah and step five is extract money from moi! Uhh, unbelievable. It is just magic. It is pure and simple magic but they couch it in scientific sounding terminology.

M: You could take this to the next level and instead of pharmacies you'll have digital pharmacies. You get your (mumbles) though your iPod or something like that.


S: Uh huh.

M: It's just, it's kind of silly. Obviously. You could even take it to the next level and get some pizza through your USB port. Which would be pretty awesome!

R: Homeopathic pizza? Not so good.

S: Homeopathic pizza, yeah. So this is part of a new category of marketing scams. I mean, who doesn't want to sell electrons? Right? For money! You sell people just digital files. They cost you nothing to make or reproduce. So if you could sell just the idea that with sound waves or specific sights or sounds that you could have a healing effect or some kind of magical effect? Man, that is the ultimate pay day for scam artists because they don't even have to have a physical product.

J: Bits, not atoms.

S: That's right.

E: Now, where does an organization, like the [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FDA Food and Drug Administration] or somebody, step in and look into this? And try to put a stop to it?

S: Well as long as they use enough weasel words and don't specifically claim to treat or cure a disease the FDA has no jurisdiction. The [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Trade_Commission Federal Trade Commission] can go after them for false advertising. But, again, they just have to be careful in how they say it. Oftentimes, FTC fines amount to a slap on the wrist to the cost of doing business. They have been more effective recently on trying to crack down on stuff like this but the scam artists can easily just stay one or two steps ahead of them. And there are just so much profit to be had selling nonsense and false hope that the existing regulation is just not adequate to deal with it.

E: So what's to stop us, Steve, from announcing that all of a sudden we're going to start to broadcast homeopathic transmissions on AM carriers. And all you have to do is turn in, tune in your AM radio to a specific frequency at a specific time, hold a glass of water next to it and there you go! You'll have your homeopathic remedy! Is there anything stopping anybody from doing something like that?

S: Uhh... ethics?

(laughter)

S: (continues) The fact that we are not evil, comes to mind.

J: So why not cut out the middle man, listen to it directly and have it imprint on the copious amounts of water in the human body?

S: Well that's what they're doing, you put the headphones on and heal while you relax. To digital homeopathic tune.

E: We have entered the [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Twilight_Zone Twilight Zone].

{{5x5outro}}

{{5X5 Navigation}}

{{5X5 categories
|Alternative Medicine = y
|Science & Medicine = y
}}

5X5 Episode 31

2012-10-20T07:07:29Z

Tnewsome:

{{transcribing all
|transcriber = tnewsome
}}
{{5X5 editing required 
|transcription = y 
|proof-reading = y 
|formatting = y
|links = y
|categories = y
|redirect = y 
|}}
{{Template:5X5 infobox 
|episodeID = 5X5 Episode 31
|Contents = Digital Homeopathy
|episodeDate = 4th August 2008
|rebecca = y
|bob = y
|jay = y
|evan = y
|guest1 = 
|downloadLink = http://media.libsyn.com/media/sgu5x5/SGU5x52008-08-04.mp3
|notesLink = http://www.theskepticsguide.org/archive/podcastinfo.aspx?mid=2&pid=31
|forumLink = http://sguforums.com/index.php/topic,12881.0.html
|}}

== Digital Homeopathy 20 years after Benveniste ==

{{5x5intro}}

S: This is the SGU 5X5 and tonight we are talking about [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy homeopathy]. This is 20th anniversary of the seminal scientific paper in 1988 written by [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_Benveniste Jacques Benveniste] and published in the journal [http://www.nature.com/nature/index.html Nature], which has parked a tremendous amount of controversy within scientific circles. The study did not convince the scientific community that homeopathy, which is the dilution of remedies behind the point of there being any original substance left behind, did not convince them that homeopathy worked or was plausible. What it did do was reveal a greta deal of poor science and even fraud in Jacques Benveniste's lab.

R: Yeah, and the sad thing is that even though there was a whole team of scientists and [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Randi James Randi] who went out there and figured out what was going on in the lab, which was that lab assistants were effecting the (clarifies) changing the samples. Even though it was thoroughly investigated at the time and proven to be a faulty experiment, it's still inspired so much crap! People still buy into homeopathy.

J: I was surprised that

{{5x5outro}}

{{5X5 Navigation}}

{{5X5 categories
|Alternative Medicine = y
|Science & Medicine = y
}}

2012-10-18T10:33:22Z

Tnewsome:

{{5X5 editing required
|transcription = y

|formatting = y
|links = y
|categories = y
|redirect = y
|}}
{{Template:5X5 infobox
|episodeID = 5X5 Episode 30
|Contents = Therapeutic touch on bone cells in culture
|episodeDate = 29th July 2008
|rebecca = y
|bob = y
|jay = y
|evan = y
|downloadLink = http://media.libsyn.com/media/sgu5x5/SGU5x52008-07-29.mp3
|notesLink = http://www.theskepticsguide.org/archive/podcastinfo.aspx?mid=2&pid=30
|forumLink = http://sguforums.com/index.php/topic,12661
|}}

== Evaluation of a UCONN study of therapeutic touch on bone cells in culture ==

{{5x5intro}}

S: This is the SGU 5X5 and tonight we're talking about therapeutic touch and a new study conducted at the University of Connecticut medical center. This was done by Gloria Gronowicz who does research into osteoblasts and the effect...which is bone cells and the growth and formation of such cells. And recently she has she has been involved in studying the effects of therapeutic touch on the growth of both normal bone cells in Petri dishes as well as osteosarcoma-derived cells, which is a form of bone cancer. And in her latest research, which has just been published, she claims that therapeutic touch significantly increased the growth of normal bone cells but not cancerous bone cells.

R: That's convenient.

E: And how did she come to that stunning conclusion.

R: Well she apparently had some therapeutic touch practitioners come into the lab twice a week and for 10 minutes at a time they held their hands a few inches from lab dishes and she claims that she saw growth in the dishes with the therapeutic touch applied. There are also dishes that had sham therapy applied meaning somebody, some student or assistant just came in and held their hand over it without sending their good vibrations, I guess. And, uhh, another set of controls were just sitting there with no mojo.

J: Yeah but it seems like, seems like she only did one round of testing on a limited number of Petri dishes. She didn't duplicate the experiment, no one else has duplicated the experiment. You know, it's such a small amount of data that it's definitely at this point untrustworthy.

E: And this is over the course of three years that this twice a week therapeutic touch regiment was conducted. I mean, what, you know, it seems like unless you have some really tight controls in place, Petri dishes are going to get handled and touched, certainly, you know, by other people over the course of three years. And who's to say there isn't some source of contamination going on here that's more likely the cause of any growth that's been occurring.

R: We should probably just clarify quickly that in therapeutic touch you don't actually touch anything. You just hold your hands somewhere near whatever needs to be healed.

S: Yeah, I've some theoretical problems with this study. Therapeutic touch practitioners are supposed to manipulate a human energy field that they can sense. They're supposed to have an intention of healing a person that's supposed to be critical to their techniques. And, uhh, in fact, previous negative studies like the Emily Rose study where she demonstrated that therapeutic touch practitioners couldn't even sense the presence of such a field, proponents have criticized such negative studies by saying that it was too artificial and there wasn't a relationship therapeutically between the practitioner and somebody that they wanted to heal. So how does that at all jive with this type of study? Could a bunch of cells in a Petri dish have a human energy field? And the practitioners have the intention of healing these cells? So that doesn't really jive with their prior excuses for negative studies. Now, of course, the human energy field doesn't exist to science: there's no way to test it, there's no way to detect it. No one is able to demonstrate reliably that they are able to detect it's presence. It doesn't have any properties that anyone can demonstrate. It's completely unnecessary to our understanding of biology and health and disease. Essentially, it is a pre-scientific, superstitious, magical belief. Therapeutic touch itself invented by Dolores Krieger and others in the 70s, it's actually a very recent practice. And there is really no credible evidence that it does anything or that it even exists. So if we take the position of the prior probability, the plausibility, the prior probability that therapeutic touch is real, it approaches zero. This study, this data, barely touches that probability. You can't look at this data in isolation. You have to look at it in the context of plausibility and prior probability. So, and Jay, you're correct, although she did collect, you know, data over several years. This data is meaningless unless it could be replicated at will. Unless other labs with other researchers can replicate it. Otherwise, this is currently in the same boat that the homeopathy research of Jacques Benveniste was in when he was research, allegedly, on cells in Petri dishes and test tubes. The data was stunning. Turns out it was all fraudulent. And it couldn't be replicated by other labs. So until this gets replicated we can't rule out some methodological flaw, a statistical fluke, or fraud. The fraud doesn't necessarily have to be on the part of, uh, of Gloria Gronowicz. It's like with Jacques Benveniste it was a lab assistant who was doing the fraud not the researcher himself. So I'm not accusing anybody of anything, the point is that we can't know all of this from one isolated lab doing, which is on completely theoretical grounds, dubious research. Certainly this doesn't come anywhere close to establishing that therapeutic touch is real or that a human energy field exists.

?: I wonder what her criteria were for legitimate therapeutic touch practitioners. I mean, are they trained? And by who? And for how long? Where? And do they have successes? Or anything like that?

S: Unfortunately there is formal training in therapeutic touch within the nursing profession. And you can get certificates and, you know, complete actually approved and accredited training program. Unfortunately. It's all internally regulated so there's no external validity to this whatsoever. A degree in nonsense, you know, essentially is worthless. But that's the, that's the criteria that are used.

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5X5 Episode 30

2012-10-18T10:27:38Z

Tnewsome:

5X5 Episode 30

2012-10-18T10:24:24Z